could someone PLEASE!!!

[newtoit]

tell me how to get my t-rex off the ground and into a hover? i have put in curves, read every manual 4 times, checked and double checked things. blades appear to track correct and are perfect balance. it just sits there and even with throttle way up, with the motor and blades turning at a very high rate. should i be doing something other than giving collective throttle?
it seems like every where i look , this is a big collective secret. what gives?

[Motions]

One thing to check is make sure your collective servo is not reversed. Unplug the motor and move the collective stick up and down and make sure the pitch is going in the right direction.

[newtoit]

One thing to check is make sure your collective servo is not reversed. Unplug the motor and move the collective stick up and down and make sure the pitch is going in the right direction.

it is going in the right direction. all 3 servos are lifting when i move the throttle up.
once i get the motor up about 3/4 (of course its not lifting) the tail starts wagging. and also my gy401 never stops with the steady blink. i thought it was supposed to stay lit?

[Motions]

The 401 will blink when there are corrections being made. That is normal. The wagging tail can be a slow servo or the gain is too high. What servo are you using and how much gain do you have set?

Back to the original problem, how much pitch do you have set at full stick? What do your pitch curves look like? You need 5.5 degrees to hover.

[newtoit]

The 401 will blink when there are corrections being made. That is normal. The wagging tail can be a slow servo or the gain is too high. What servo are you using and how much gain do you have set?

Back to the original problem, how much pitch do you have set at full stick? What do your pitch curves look like? You need 5.5 degrees to hover.

i am using s9650 servo for the tail. the gyro blinks when the heli is idol and not moving and no commands from the tx are being given. and it blinks when the motor is at idol as well. i am not even sure i have this in heading hold mode. all instructions i have for heli, gyro, and tx are beyond me and my level of intelligence, i believe at this point.
numbers are not mystrong point.
i have a pitch and throttle curve set up in basic mode. at least i think i do. not sure what it means. i copied one from a website. btw, do i have to set up stuff in advance mode also? i have a futaba 7ch. how do i set 5.5 degrees? how much gain on the tail sero? i dont know. do i set that on the gyro or tx? both? the tail servo was going left and right way to far so i cut each end under"e point" on the tx to make the servo stop running when it went l-r. 26l and 22r . cut down from 100 each way. is this bad?
pitch curves on basic menu are: p1=50% p2=69% p3=83% p4=93% p5=100%
throttle curves on basic menu: p1=0% p2=30% p3=65% p4=85% p5=100%

its all mathmatical gibberish to me. thats all i know thats been set. where do i go from here?
thanks motions.

[newtoit]

someone? ....... anyone?............ so nobody knows this stuff?

[mb323]

Hi Newtoit, did you get any answers?

I don't know anything about T-Rex specifically, but long time heli flyer.

You will need a pitch guage to set your pitch curves. So for example, you have a 5 point pitch curve, P1-P5, in this case P3 is your mid stick position, the position of your main blades when you left stick is at the mid point (straight up half way between up and down). Your left stick is throttle and pitch, aka collective.

Normally mid stick (collective) is either set to 0 degrees or hover (for T-Rex apparently it is ~+5.5 degrees) depending on your skill and preference. Your P1 (low stick) should be -5 or higher, your P5 (high stick) should be about +10 degrees. (again, depeding on preference)

It would be a good idea to invest in a RPM gauge (Tach), there are a few different ones out there:

http://www4.mailordercentral.com/heliproz/prodinfo.asp?number=804260
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXPX81&P=ML

your main blades should be turning somewhere around 1800 RPM's for a stable hover. (again, more or less depending on your preference and skill)

Now your gryo and tail rotor setup could be a problem, the best thing to do is to find someone who has setup a heli before and who can hover your T-Rex to verify that everything is functioning correctly.

For the gyro settings, heading hold is above 50%, 78% is a good starting point. When working with heli's RTFM is very important, if you don't understand it, keep reading it until you do.

I would highly recommend starting out with a simulator such as Real Flight G3 or Reflex. I spent 3 days a week for a month practicing on a SIM before ever attemping hovering in real life. Also invest in some training gear, you will need it until you can maintain a stable hover.

#1 thing to remember, be safe!

Here is a web site to cover evertyhing else:
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/

Good luck, hope it is working out well.

[newtoit]

Hi Newtoit, did you get any answers?

I don't know anything about T-Rex specifically, but long time heli flyer.

You will need a pitch guage to set your pitch curves. So for example, you have a 5 point pitch curve, P1-P5, in this case P3 is your mid stick position, the position of your main blades when you left stick is at the mid point (straight up half way between up and down). Your left stick is throttle and pitch, aka collective.

Normally mid stick (collective) is either set to 0 degrees or hover (for T-Rex apparently it is ~+5.5 degrees) depending on your skill and preference. Your P1 (low stick) should be -5 or higher, your P5 (high stick) should be about +10 degrees. (again, depeding on preference)

It would be a good idea to invest in a RPM gauge (Tach), there are a few different ones out there:

http://www4.mailordercentral.com/heliproz/prodinfo.asp?number=804260
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXPX81&P=ML

your main blades should be turning somewhere around 1800 RPM's for a stable hover. (again, more or less depending on your preference and skill)

Now your gryo and tail rotor setup could be a problem, the best thing to do is to find someone who has setup a heli before and who can hover your T-Rex to verify that everything is functioning correctly.

For the gyro settings, heading hold is above 50%, 78% is a good starting point. When working with heli's RTFM is very important, if you don't understand it, keep reading it until you do.

I would highly recommend starting out with a simulator such as Real Flight G3 or Reflex. I spent 3 days a week for a month practicing on a SIM before ever attemping hovering in real life. Also invest in some training gear, you will need it until you can maintain a stable hover.

#1 thing to remember, be safe!

Here is a web site to cover evertyhing else:
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/

Good luck, hope it is working out well.

thanks dude.
no, i never got anymore answers. i think motions gave up on me. i am still not flying. is the rule of thumb that the pitch # should be set below what throttle # on say points2-3or 4? do the advance menu idle up 1 and 2 have to have to be programmed as well as the normal throttle and pitch curves? are idle 1 and 2 more for trick style flying? i turned the gain on the gyro itself, all the way down. the tail stopped wagging at high rpms. is this good?
i did order training gear last night. i thought it would be a good idea.
i have a pitch gauge but i need to figure out how its used. flight sim? i am sure i should get one but i am broke from this heli and those things are high.
be safe? blades already gashed my fingure open last week. its healing. busted me on my middle finger nail and went under the cuticle and skin and then exited leaving a nice deep cut and my nail was loose.
about fed up with this thing and am ready to send it flying the old fashioned way. i have been all over the internet and the tips and instruction on these things are vague non descriptive. people who give answers assume that everyone is good with physics, math and have a working knowledge or know someone. why cant someone write the rc heli book for dummies. if i ever figure it out,
i might.
thanks again

[HeatSeeker{DEN}]

:cool: Thats one book I would defffffffinatly buy! :cool:

[mb323]

thanks dude.
no, i never got anymore answers. i think motions gave up on me. i am still not flying. is the rule of thumb that the pitch # should be set below what throttle # on say points2-3or 4? do the advance menu idle up 1 and 2 have to have to be programmed as well as the normal throttle and pitch curves? are idle 1 and 2 more for trick style flying? i turned the gain on the gyro itself, all the way down. the tail stopped wagging at high rpms. is this good?
i did order training gear last night. i thought it would be a good idea.
i have a pitch gauge but i need to figure out how its used. flight sim? i am sure i should get one but i am broke from this heli and those things are high.
be safe? blades already gashed my fingure open last week. its healing. busted me on my middle finger nail and went under the cuticle and skin and then exited leaving a nice deep cut and my nail was loose.
about fed up with this thing and am ready to send it flying the old fashioned way. i have been all over the internet and the tips and instruction on these things are vague non descriptive. people who give answers assume that everyone is good with physics, math and have a working knowledge or know someone. why cant someone write the rc heli book for dummies. if i ever figure it out,
i might.
thanks again

All good questions, here are some answers:

Well, as I am sure you are already aware, RC Heli flying is not for dummies. They are high performance machines and must be operated with care. When you have a carbon fiber blade moving at 2000 rpm's, I'm sure they could take off a finger if you are not careful.

FYI, that book you are looking for is at: http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/

I'm not associated with little rotors but they have a fantastic beginners guide.

Also, check this site out, they have information specific to T-Rex and getting started: http://helihobby.com/html/rc_helicopter_training.html


That said, I will do my best to answer all of your questions so keep asking, I'm not going anywhere until you are at least hovering. There are a lot of good resources on the Internet but you have to be prepared to read. (see the link above and the links below)

Learning to fly a Heli takes patience and practice. Only progress skill once you have mastered the previous skill. The first basic skill to learn is hovering.

You may think a sim is expensive, but it will likely pay for itself in one crash or if it prevents one crash. If you just expect to take a heli out and hover, I gurantee you will crash. How much did you pay for your kit? If you want an easy heli to fly, try the Blade CX, you might be able to hover without crashing. Go to your local hobby store, they usually have one hooked up you can try.

Gyro: I wouldn't turn the gain all the way down, about half way should be good, but if the tail is not wagging yes that is a good thing. Do you know if your remote gain is hooked up to your receiver? Follow the programming instructions in your radio manual for gyro.

Pitch/Throttle curves: The two are related in that both pitch and throttle affect head speed. Your goal is to maintain a constant head speed at all stick positions and throttle positions. Setting your pitch will require a pitch guage. (read the instructions for the pitch guage thoroughly).

Here is a link that describes pitch curves and pitch settings, it is very specifc and detailed:
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/pitchsettings.asp

Here is a link that describes throttle curves.
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/throttlesettings.asp

You do not need to setup Idle up 1 or Idle up 2, these are for advance flying. Norm is used for hovering. The other two are used for forward flight and 3D flying respectively. It doesn't hurt to program them, but you won't need them until you have mastered hovering, and I'm talking hovering in all orientations. First master tail in hovering in one spot.

I highly caution you, do not attempt to hover without training gear and keep the heli lower than half the width of the training gear. i.e. if the training gear is 2' accross, don't let the heli get more than 1' off the ground.

So, let's review, the numbers programmed into your radio (P1-P5) for both pitch and throttle are irrelevant. What matters is pitch in degrees for each position of the stick and RPM's.

Trust me, get the sim, check ebay, a friend of mine got a really good deal on Real Flight G3.

You have a good heli and a good radio. I'm sure you will be hoving in no time you just need to be patient and work on understanding how to setup your heli. If you are still having trouble, find someone in your area that flies heli's and get their advice.

If you followed your instruction manual on the setup, you should be good, can you send your a list of your configuration? Also, have you verified that all controls move in the right directions?

One last thing, DON"T PUT YOUR HANDS INTO THE MOVING PARTS. ;)

[newtoit]

All good questions, here are some answers:

Well, as I am sure you are already aware, RC Heli flying is not for dummies. They are high performance machines and must be operated with care. When you have a carbon fiber blade moving at 2000 rpm's, I'm sure they could take off a finger if you are not careful.

FYI, that book you are looking for is at: http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/

I'm not associated with little rotors but they have a fantastic beginners guide.

Also, check this site out, they have information specific to T-Rex and getting started: http://helihobby.com/html/rc_helicopter_training.html


That said, I will do my best to answer all of your questions so keep asking, I'm not going anywhere until you are at least hovering. There are a lot of good resources on the Internet but you have to be prepared to read. (see the link above and the links below)

Learning to fly a Heli takes patience and practice. Only progress skill once you have mastered the previous skill. The first basic skill to learn is hovering.

You may think a sim is expensive, but it will likely pay for itself in one crash or if it prevents one crash. If you just expect to take a heli out and hover, I gurantee you will crash. How much did you pay for your kit? If you want an easy heli to fly, try the Blade CX, you might be able to hover without crashing. Go to your local hobby store, they usually have one hooked up you can try.

Gyro: I wouldn't turn the gain all the way down, about half way should be good, but if the tail is not wagging yes that is a good thing. Do you know if your remote gain is hooked up to your receiver? Follow the programming instructions in your radio manual for gyro.

Pitch/Throttle curves: The two are related in that both pitch and throttle affect head speed. Your goal is to maintain a constant head speed at all stick positions and throttle positions. Setting your pitch will require a pitch guage. (read the instructions for the pitch guage thoroughly).

Here is a link that describes pitch curves and pitch settings, it is very specifc and detailed:
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/pitchsettings.asp

Here is a link that describes throttle curves.
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/throttlesettings.asp

You do not need to setup Idle up 1 or Idle up 2, these are for advance flying. Norm is used for hovering. The other two are used for forward flight and 3D flying respectively. It doesn't hurt to program them, but you won't need them until you have mastered hovering, and I'm talking hovering in all orientations. First master tail in hovering in one spot.

I highly caution you, do not attempt to hover without training gear and keep the heli lower than half the width of the training gear. i.e. if the training gear is 2' accross, don't let the heli get more than 1' off the ground.

So, let's review, the numbers programmed into your radio (P1-P5) for both pitch and throttle are irrelevant. What matters is pitch in degrees for each position of the stick and RPM's.

Trust me, get the sim, check ebay, a friend of mine got a really good deal on Real Flight G3.

You have a good heli and a good radio. I'm sure you will be hoving in no time you just need to be patient and work on understanding how to setup your heli. If you are still having trouble, find someone in your area that flies heli's and get their advice.

If you followed your instruction manual on the setup, you should be good, can you send your a list of your configuration? Also, have you verified that all controls move in the right directions?

One last thing, DON"T PUT YOUR HANDS INTO THE MOVING PARTS. ;)

you are a good guy. i really appreciate this!
i paid $500.00 for the se v2 kit. i have the futaba gy401 gyro with the s9650 servo. 3 hitec hs55, aon 3550 motor and the 35amp esc that came with the model. i have the hitec 6ch rx and the futaba 7ch tx. i have the polyquest 14v 2100mah (i think)battery thats the setup and with all the extra parts and extras i bought, i probably have about $2500 wrapped in this thing so far. i had to buy more servos and extra blue gear after it became a meat grinder. that happened because i forgot to unplug the battery before i cut the tx off.

remote gain? would that be the single wire from the gyro that i put into ch5 on my rx? if thats the one, i have no clue what its for. i read the gyros instructions about 3 times in a row last night and it blew my mind. that wire apparently does something onthe gyro on idle1 and 2. it is on switch e which is 3 position. when i flipped it and held the tail rotor to the left or right while i flipped it, it would hold the position of the tail blade. that did not seem right to me. i dont know what its for. also the instuctions say the light on the gyro should be on steady (no blinking) when it is in heading hold mode and that is its normal position unless its getting imputs and then it would be blinking. well its blinking with no inputs or movement and no motor running.
i dont know how to put it in different modes like heading hold or avcs. i have the switch on the gyro set to ds since i have a digital servo.
i did figure that much out. it still just blinks so i figure i am supposed to do some setting up for that on the rx also. i know i should stay out of revo mixing with a heading hold gyro.

here are the curves for both throttle and pitch curves i have now. i got these from a website.
throttle :p1=0 p2=25 p3=65 p4=75 p5=100
pitch p1=23 p2=30 p3=50 p4=80 p5=85

i also set idol 1 and idol 2 by someones example online but its not important right now since you told me that basic is for hovering. would you have to switch the radio from basic to advance in order for those settings to work or does it matter?

i am pretty sure at this point after talking with you that i have pitch problem. would you agree? i think my heli is set up right. i have been over it lots of times and have even had to swap out parts and recenter servos. i will work with the pitch gauge tomorrow. i lso am concerned about one thing on my helis physical setup. it all looks to be at zero except one rotor holder looks just the most slightly turned. dont know how much of a difference that would make. everything else is lined up and zeroed perfect at mid stick.
all servos move in their correct dirrections corresponding to the sticks. the collective goes up and down.
i did orser a tachometer tonight at your suggestion. i will talk to you more tomorrow. thank you.

[newtoit]

i just got an email from an rc heli dealer who says, that the radio has to be programmed prior to allignment of the servo horns.
i followed a dvd i ordered from helihobby on setting up the t-rex ccpm. the guy set his stick in the middle and then placed the horns on the servos. everything was straight and zero. he programmed the radio after. now i am confused. what is the right way?

[Motions]

The model needs to be setup mechanically first the best you can get it. Only then do you make adjustments in the radio. If you program the radio first, your mechanical setup will be way off and the radio has to compensate too much to get a steady flight.

[mb323]

The model needs to be setup mechanically first the best you can get it. Only then do you make adjustments in the radio. If you program the radio first, your mechanical setup will be way off and the radio has to compensate too much to get a steady flight.

Motions, are you referring to sub-trims? If so, you are both right.

You will want your radio configured for the basic heli setup, ie CCPM and standard linear pitch curves. Center your sticks and set your control horns as close to 90 degrees as possible (should be covered under setup) once you have mechanically set the control horns as close to 90 as possible. After that you can use sub-trims to center the servos exaclty.

Once those things are done, then you would start adjusting your pitch and throttle curves.

[newtoit]

The model needs to be setup mechanically first the best you can get it. Only then do you make adjustments in the radio. If you program the radio first, your mechanical setup will be way off and the radio has to compensate too much to get a steady flight.

the model is set up. how would you posibly get 3 servos to zero without having the radio turn on to do it? to put the radio on means the servos have to read some program on it to get at least close to zero. therfore you would have to set the radio up first somehow. no? if not how do you know where to set the horn so its level? if you just stick them on after you mount servos and turn on the radio .................. ah the hell with it. this hobby sucks!
i dont think anyone really knows and if they really do they aint talking. heres a concept for the manufacturers of all this garbage, write and include some literate instructions to your products. im selling this junk on ebay.

[Motions]

To setup mechanically, you need to have all you throttle and pitch curves linear and all your trims and sub-trims centered on the radio. This will set your servos to mechanical center.

Then adjust your servo arms and linkages to the correct lengths to center everything. Set your pitch to 0 deg at 50% stick. Then set your endpoints to eliminate binding. Now the model should be setup mechanically.

Now you can go to the radio and start making minor adjustments to get everything perfect. Then setup the gyro, tail, pitch curves, and throttle curves. You should set the D/R to about 50%-60% on the cyclic just to start out.

A very helpful website for all aspects of the Trex is trextuning.com. Here's a link to the setup section that may help further http://www.trextuning.com/setup1.php

Anyone that's been in this hobby has said the words "I'm selling this junk on eBay". It can be a VERY frustrating hobby. If you don't have patience, it will get the best of you.

[mb323]

the model is set up. how would you posibly get 3 servos to zero without having the radio turn on to do it? to put the radio on means the servos have to read some program on it to get at least close to zero. therfore you would have to set the radio up first somehow. no? if not how do you know where to set the horn so its level? if you just stick them on after you mount servos and turn on the radio .................. ah the hell with it. this hobby sucks!
i dont think anyone really knows and if they really do they aint talking. heres a concept for the manufacturers of all this garbage, write and include some literate instructions to your products. im selling this junk on ebay.

Hey Newtoit, sorry to see you are so furstrated. RC Heli flying may not be for everyone, it takes a lot of patience and practice. Unfortuantely the proper setup and confirugation of a heli and Tx can be a bit complicated and confusing, that's why it's good to have a mentor and have someone help you setup.

Just from the conversation, you have all of the basic concepts, and your not far off. You are right that you have to turn on your radio and have the correct setup to center your servos properly.

The web site I provided above is a good starting place to understanding the concepts.
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/pitchsettings.asp

If you choose to stick with it I will be here to help, otherwise good luck with the sale.

[mb323]

To setup mechanically, you need to have all you throttle and pitch curves linear and all your trims and sub-trims centered on the radio. This will set your servos to mechanical center.

Then adjust your servo arms and linkages to the correct lengths to center everything. Set your pitch to 0 deg at 50% stick. Then set your endpoints to eliminate binding. Now the model should be setup mechanically.

Now you can go to the radio and start making minor adjustments to get everything perfect. Then setup the gyro, tail, pitch curves, and throttle curves. You should set the D/R to about 50%-60% on the cyclic just to start out.

A very helpful website for all aspects of the Trex is trextuning.com. Here's a link to the setup section that may help further http://www.trextuning.com/setup1.php

Anyone that's been in this hobby has said the words "I'm selling this junk on eBay". It can be a VERY frustrating hobby. If you don't have patience, it will get the best of you.

Well said Motions, and an excellent web site!

[Motions]

Thanks mb.

I'm not sure how I forgot this, but take a visit to this thread http://runryder.com/helicopter/t241028p1/?top=1143068046
It is full of basic instructional videos on the Trex and is VERY helpful for beginners.

[mb323]

Newtoit,

If you are still reading this thread, you had a lot of questions regarding pitch and you indicated that one of your blades was off slightly. A pitch guage can help get them close, but to get them exact you will have to check your blade tracking. I would agree, you likely have a pitch problem, it also sounds like you may not have enough head speed, a tachometer will answer that question.

Blade balancing and tracking are very important, is your heli shaking violently?

Here is some information on blade tracking.
http://www.littlerotors.com/setup/tracking.asp

[newtoit]

To setup mechanically, you need to have all you throttle and pitch curves linear and all your trims and sub-trims centered on the radio. This will set your servos to mechanical center.

Then adjust your servo arms and linkages to the correct lengths to center everything. Set your pitch to 0 deg at 50% stick. Then set your endpoints to eliminate binding. Now the model should be setup mechanically.

Now you can go to the radio and start making minor adjustments to get everything perfect. Then setup the gyro, tail, pitch curves, and throttle curves. You should set the D/R to about 50%-60% on the cyclic just to start out.

A very helpful website for all aspects of the Trex is trextuning.com. Here's a link to the setup section that may help further http://www.trextuning.com/setup1.php

Anyone that's been in this hobby has said the words "I'm selling this junk on eBay". It can be a VERY frustrating hobby. If you don't have patience, it will get the best of you.

all this was done to a T. trextuning.com? been there , done that. its missing something.

[newtoit]

Thanks mb.

I'm not sure how I forgot this, but take a visit to this thread http://runryder.com/helicopter/t241028p1/?top=1143068046
It is full of basic instructional videos on the Trex and is VERY helpful for beginners.

been there done that. and i did buy a dvd on how to set up the t-rex ccpm from heli hobby. he skipped a bunch of junk, did not explain in detail on other stuff. did not set up the esc. was using a hitec radio and building the plastic version of t-rex. worthless.

[Motions]

Let me ask the important question...do you have a pitch guage and do you know how to use it?

After all this, I forgot what the thread was about. I looked at the original post and the only problem seems to be you don't have enough pitch. What is your pitch at full throttle?

[newtoit]

Let me ask the important question...do you have a pitch guage and do you know how to use it?

After all this, I forgot what the thread was about. I looked at the original post and the only problem seems to be you don't have enough pitch. What is your pitch at full throttle?

i do have one. i have cooled off a bit. i linethe top of the pitch gauge up with the flybar and move the collective up and down keeping the gauge level to take the reading, correct?
i will get back to you tomorrow as i had to take the head apart to tighten a collar screw i noticed was coming out. that may have caused some binding. i kept hearing a knock as i moved the collective up and down. not angry at anyone here. maybe myself. sorry if i seemed to be.

[mb323]

i do have one. i have cooled off a bit. i linethe top of the pitch gauge up with the flybar and move the collective up and down keeping the gauge level to take the reading, correct?
i will get back to you tomorrow as i had to take the head apart to tighten a collar screw i noticed was coming out. that may have caused some binding. i kept hearing a knock as i moved the collective up and down. not angry at anyone here. maybe myself. sorry if i seemed to be.

Welcom back, yes you are correct on how to read your pitch. Don't be to hard on yourself, RC Heli setup and flying is not easy, but it is well worth the effort, especially when you first learn to hover, and that first time you take your training gear off.

[newtoit]

Welcom back, yes you are correct on how to read your pitch. Don't be to hard on yourself, RC Heli setup and flying is not easy, but it is well worth the effort, especially when you first learn to hover, and that first time you take your training gear off.


thanks mb323. i will take your word that it is worth it. some one just told me i am using the wrong battery with the esc i have. polyquest 4s 14 volt 2100mah with the align 35 amp. says i need a 3s or i could burn the esc and the heli could cut out at high rpms.

[Motions]

Yes. A 4S will definately fry a Align ESC. I fried mine with 3S. I vowed never to buy Align electronics again.

[axis]

So far so good with my Align esc (knocks on wood)...

[Helifino]

I just got my Trex..I haven't put it together yet. All of this tech stuff can blow your mind.
Hang in there and don't give up! ;)

[newtoit]

ok , heres what the pitch gauge says.
at low stick -7 at mid -3 at full 3
at mid stick, all servos are straight left and right.

[Motions]

WOOOOO!!

That would be the problem. You need at least +5.5 to hover. What are your radio settings?
The very first thing you need to do is put your stick in the middle (50%) and adjust your linkages until you have 0 deg on the blades. Then you can start adjusting your curves to get the correct pitch. Your settings should be something like

Low stick = -2 deg
Mid stick = 0 deg
3/4 stick = +5.5 deg
Full stick = +10 deg

This is only for normal mode. I won't get into negative pitch right now.

[newtoit]

WOOOOO!!

That would be the problem. You need at least +5.5 to hover. What are your radio settings?
The very first thing you need to do is put your stick in the middle (50%) and adjust your linkages until you have 0 deg on the blades. Then you can start adjusting your curves to get the correct pitch. Your settings should be something like

Low stick = -2 deg
Mid stick = 0 deg
3/4 stick = +5.5 deg
Full stick = +10 deg

This is only for normal mode. I won't get into negative pitch right now.

radio pitch settings are 23 30 50 80 85
would i need to adjust under pitch curve or sub trim on the radio?
what would the radio settings be, to get the numbers you say? just a good general area.

btw, my linkages are the exact mm of the instructions.

[Motions]

radio pitch settings are 23 30 50 80 85
would i need to adjust under pitch curve or sub trim on the radio?
what would the radio settings be, to get the numbers you say? just a good general area.

btw, my linkages are the exact mm of the instructions.

First, put your stick in the middle and make sure you have 0 deg on the blades. If you do, move the stick to the full up position and adjust P5 in your pitch curve until you get +10 deg. Then, move the stick to 3/4 and adjust P4 until you get +5.5 deg. If you can do this, you should be able to hover.

NEVER adjust the sub-trim once you have the model mechanically setup. This will screw up a lot of things.

The link lengths in the manual are ONLY a starting point. 99% of the time you will always have to adjust them during setup.

[newtoit]

First, put your stick in the middle and make sure you have 0 deg on the blades. If you do, move the stick to the full up position and adjust P5 in your pitch curve until you get +10 deg. Then, move the stick to 3/4 and adjust P4 until you get +5.5 deg. If you can do this, you should be able to hover.

NEVER adjust the sub-trim once you have the model mechanically setup. This will screw up a lot of things.

The link lengths in the manual are ONLY a starting point. 99% of the time you will always have to adjust them during setup.

ok, this is just plain rediculous. no i dont have 0 on mid stick. my links are exact to the manual. if i cant go by that, and i cant adjust anything on the radio, pitch curves dont do it as originally suggested, then it becomes like a rubiks cube with a billion possibilitys and 1 solution. i never solved that cube. this would take an aerospace engineer. no one knows how to exactly set up one of these pieces of junk? they are all the same . precision cut.
why beat around the bush? just freakin lay it out.
why am i not at zero at midstick? if i build the damn model as the instructions say and then follow all the answers i get from you and the dude over at techmodels .com then whats the deal? now its pull links and twist and turn and put back on until i stumble on it? thats not what i was hearing over the last few days. well i did go try it and it did nothing but put me further from the zero point. i was closer before i started adjusting links.
if you dont really know, you shouldnt just throw anything out there. you may think its funny but i dont.
i adjusted a link. then i had to adjust 2 more to level out again. then i was further from zero.
cmon people. these things dont really work , do they? jeez whats the fun in this?

[mb323]

ok, this is just plain rediculous. no i dont have 0 on mid stick. my links are exact to the manual. if i cant go by that, and i cant adjust anything on the radio, pitch curves dont do it as originally suggested, then it becomes like a rubiks cube with a billion possibilitys and 1 solution. i never solved that cube. this would take an aerospace engineer. no one knows how to exactly set up one of these pieces of junk? they are all the same . precision cut.
why beat around the bush? just freakin lay it out.
why am i not at zero at midstick? if i build the damn model as the instructions say and then follow all the answers i get from you and the dude over at techmodels .com then whats the deal? now its pull links and twist and turn and put back on until i stumble on it? thats not what i was hearing over the last few days. well i did go try it and it did nothing but put me further from the zero point. i was closer before i started adjusting links.
if you dont really know, you shouldnt just throw anything out there. you may think its funny but i dont.
i adjusted a link. then i had to adjust 2 more to level out again. then i was further from zero.
cmon people. these things dont really work , do they? jeez whats the fun in this?

Ok, first take a deep breath, this is where patience comes in, there is no one magical answer that will get your heli hovering out of the box. There are variations in radio gear, electornics, servos, servo arms, and even linkages. A 1 or 2 mm variation could be 2-3 degrees in pitch. It's not impossible but It takes time to setup a heli and get it right. I'll be honest, you have not picked a beginner heli. That doesn't mean it won't work, but it requires a lot more patience than you basic RTF (ready to fly) or toy heli both in setup and learning to fly. Also, the T-Rex is extremely popular and a very capable machine. It would be nice if the instructions were perfect and accounted for all possible combinations of equipment, setup and skill level but I have never seen that happen.

Do you have a digital camera? Something that would help a lot is if you could turn your radio on, center your left stick and take a picture that includes the swashplate, servos and head linkages. Also do this for full stick and low stick.

Think of it this way, you have asked a doctor to diagnose a pain in your back side remotely by email (or a news group as in this case). We are willing to help out of the kindness of our hearts and the passion for the hobby. I have configured and flown 6 different heli's of my own not to mention the dozen or so I have help to get off the ground and I can tell from what Motions is telling you that he has a lot of experience as well and is steering you down the right path. As I said, it's not an impossible task but it will take patience. If you just want a toy heli or a RTF heli you can buzz around with no setup, I would suggest a BladeRunner or Blade CX.

[Fflipp204]

Just read some of the comments .. I have the Blade CP with the aerobatic upgrade. I don't know much about the T-Rex, but I will have to admit that I did wire my motor backwards causing the heli to go down and not up :o .

Don't know if that is the problem or not, but it's worth looking into.

[newtoit]

Ok, first take a deep breath, this is where patience comes in, there is no one magical answer that will get your heli hovering out of the box. There are variations in radio gear, electornics, servos, servo arms, and even linkages. A 1 or 2 mm variation could be 2-3 degrees in pitch. It's not impossible but It takes time to setup a heli and get it right. I'll be honest, you have not picked a beginner heli. That doesn't mean it won't work, but it requires a lot more patience than you basic RTF (ready to fly) or toy heli both in setup and learning to fly. Also, the T-Rex is extremely popular and a very capable machine. It would be nice if the instructions were perfect and accounted for all possible combinations of equipment, setup and skill level but I have never seen that happen.

Do you have a digital camera? Something that would help a lot is if you could turn your radio on, center your left stick and take a picture that includes the swashplate, servos and head linkages. Also do this for full stick and low stick.

Think of it this way, you have asked a doctor to diagnose a pain in your back side remotely by email (or a news group as in this case). We are willing to help out of the kindness of our hearts and the passion for the hobby. I have configured and flown 6 different heli's of my own not to mention the dozen or so I have help to get off the ground and I can tell from what Motions is telling you that he has a lot of experience as well and is steering you down the right path. As I said, it's not an impossible task but it will take patience. If you just want a toy heli or a RTF heli you can buzz around with no setup, I would suggest a BladeRunner or Blade CX.
i am gonna remeasure all links and reinstall like they were before i tried adjusting them tonight. my swash was nice and even and i was 2 clicks from being at zero. then i should still be back at being 2 clicks off and from there i will center the stick and only adjust the "A" links till i get the pitch to 0. that should do it unless someone can think of something else? i do agree with motions about the subtrim. i have heard that a few times and i dont think you should really have to mess with that to zero this new bitch of mine. motions may have meant to just adjust the "A" links. if this does not work tomorrow, i wont bother anyone here anymore cause i can see i am getting frustrated enough to take it out on people and its not even you guys problem. like you said , you are doing it out of the kindness of your hearts. if this dont work i plan to crank up the juice, full blast and put my foot into it and send it sailing. i am gonna see this damn thing fly ,one way or another.
i would advise any new people prospecting to get into rc helis to just not do it. it aint worth it unless you know someone who can get you over the humps and started up. and those rtf copters? they aint no better. i just sent a walkera 36 back to the guy i got it from on ebay. they are not "ready to fly" dont be mislead newbies. you better get your aerospace degree before venturing here.

[Motions]

if this dont work i plan to crank up the juice, full blast and put my foot into it and send it sailing. i am gonna see this damn thing fly ,one way or another.

LOL!!!! That got my morning started with a laugh.

To zero the blades, you need to adjust the "D" linkage not the "A". Leave the "A" where it is. The "D" link is the one going from the swash to the mixer arm. You also need to do both blades separately so they are equal.

P.S. Tracking is also adjusted by the "D" link. If you get to that point. :D

[newtoit]

LOL!!!! That got my morning started with a laugh.

To zero the blades, you need to adjust the "D" linkage not the "A". Leave the "A" where it is. The "D" link is the one going from the swash to the mixer arm. You also need to do both blades separately so they are equal.

P.S. Tracking is also adjusted by the "D" link. If you get to that point. :D

glad i could give you a humour pill with your coffee based on my misery.
here are the readings now. -12 low , 0 mid, 5.5 3/4 11 high.
the high and low sound pretty bad. i dont think thats right. but i got zero! have not tried to hover yet. i wanted to run this by you first. this was done by adjusting the d links.

[newtoit]

i moved the p setting under swashplate from 50% to 30% and my settings now say:
-4 low, 0 mid, 5 3/4, and 8 high. almost sounds like success. have not tried to hover yet.
what does it sound like to you motions and guys? have i done it? have i solved the riddle?
am i a helicopter god? (motions spits coffee laughing)

[mb323]

glad i could give you a humour pill with your coffee based on my misery.
here are the readings now. -12 low , 0 mid, 5.5 3/4 11 high.
the high and low sound pretty bad. i dont think thats right. but i got zero! have not tried to hover yet. i wanted to run this by you first. this was done by adjusting the d links.

Congratulations Newtoit, you now have your basic pitch settings. You can now use the pitch curve to your end points.

See Motion's previous post:
Low stick = -2 deg
Mid stick = 0 deg
3/4 stick = +5.5 deg
Full stick = +10 deg

This will make the heli a little easier to fly.

Caution, do not attempt to get it off the ground without attaching the training gear, and don't let it get more than a few inches off the ground.

Ok, as for the gyro, refering to the maual, the light will only be steady when the gyro is in heading lock mode. Additionally, the gyro should be turned on in heading lock mode when it is powered up. Refer to the Monitor LED display in the manual, and then double check the programming from the example immediately below the Monitor LED display section.
http://www.futaba-rc.com/manuals/futm0807-manual.pdf

[newtoit]

Congratulations Newtoit, you now have your basic pitch settings. You can now use the pitch curve to your end points.

See Motion's previous post:
Low stick = -2 deg
Mid stick = 0 deg
3/4 stick = +5.5 deg
Full stick = +10 deg

This will make the heli a little easier to fly.

Caution, do not attempt to get it off the ground without attaching the training gear, and don't let it get more than a few inches off the ground.

Ok, as for the gyro, refering to the maual, the light will only be steady when the gyro is in heading lock mode. Additionally, the gyro should be turned on in heading lock mode when it is powered up. Refer to the Monitor LED display in the manual, and then double check the programming from the example immediately below the Monitor LED display section.
http://www.futaba-rc.com/manuals/futm0807-manual.pdf



thanks buddy.
got the training gear today and am just gonna wait for the new battery before trying to fly.
should be here tomorrow. got the tach/voltmeter
today also. preciate you guys being patient with a hot head and i hope i did not offend anyone. was not my intention. i was angry at the world. sure you all have been there with this stuff. thanks for all the advise and tips. sure i will be needing more.
now, will adjusting pitch curves on the radio as in motions examples, actually show me different numbers on the pitch gauge than i have now when i adjust those points? in other words if i change point 4, would that change the hover pitch which is now 5 0r 5 1/2?
or point 3 which i think is supposed to be 0? am i understanding this right?

oh and the gyro? is heading lock mode something i turn or its automatic? would the light become stay on in flight or continue to blink?

[Motions]

Leave P3 at 50% (and 0 deg). Adjust P5 down until you get +10 deg pitch at full stick. P4 will be your hovering point so set it to around +5.5 deg with the stick at 3/4. You are on your way.

Again, I recommend watching Bob's video on setting up the gyro, http://runryder.com/helicopter/t242253p1 it's very informative and will show the do's and don'ts on the 401.

After all of this, I can only guess what the posts are going to be once you try to get it in the air. I may have to hit the censor button a few times.

[newtoit]

Leave P3 at 50% (and 0 deg). Adjust P5 down until you get +10 deg pitch at full stick. P4 will be your hovering point so set it to around +5.5 deg with the stick at 3/4. You are on your way.

Again, I recommend watching Bob's video on setting up the gyro, http://runryder.com/helicopter/t242253p1 it's very informative and will show the do's and don'ts on the 401.

After all of this, I can only guess what the posts are going to be once you try to get it in the air. I may have to hit the censor button a few times.

will do motions. thank you. why would you have to hit the censor button? who? on me? nah. i am the most level headed and cool in stressful situations. i never sweat it. i was just trying to see how much you guys knew. i had it all the time. i am also full of it.
this almost changed my entire make-up. i cant beleive i let it get to me like that. it almost beat me. i stressed mainly cause i had so much money invested and my wife was not too happy that i could not get this thing going. and well all of you who have wives know what i mean.
my wife has never not seen me be able to do something for the most part, without help. she was starting to see a man unravel over a hobby model.

i am sure i will have more questions. i hope i am over the biggest hump now. i will probably get a sim before i fly. i only want to see this thing try and lift first. i dont want to fly it yet. i cant afford to break it.
everyone have a good weekend and to all who gave me advise, a great big group hug for ya.

[mb323]

Don't forget to check the RPM's, I would say anything between 1600 - 1800 would be good. The lower the RPM's the more pitch it will take to get it off the ground but it will have a softer/mushy feel.

When you do try it for the first time both to see if it will work and when you attempt to hover. With training gear on, find a large flat level surface such as a basketball court, tennis court or parking lot (if it's level) with no objstructions or people within 15-30 feet. If you are outdoors, make sure there is no wind, not even a breeze. Once you get good at hovering you will be able to handle wind and different surroundings, but don't spin this thing up in your kitchen or your backyard until you get really good.

Glad to hear you are going the sim route, it will save you lots of money. If you crash a sim, you hit the reset button, if you crash the real thing... $$$...

We have all had some furstration/challenge or another. I am working out a vibration in my shogun v2, I have a buddy chasing down a gremlin in his tail rotor.

[Motions]

Don't forget to check the RPM's, I would say anything between 1600 - 1800 would be good. The lower the RPM's the more pitch it will take to get it off the ground but it will have a softer/mushy feel.

That headspeed is too low for the Trex. I would get it to at least 2200 to make it stable.

[mb323]

That headspeed is too low for the Trex. I would get it to at least 2200 to make it stable.

Thanks for correcting me. My Shogun spins 2000 in normal, 2200 in idl2. But those are setup for 3D and more responsive than a beginner would need.

I read other reviews that indicated for the T-Rex in norm 1700-1800 is good and 2200 is for 3D setup.

Here is a good review, they cover headspeed in the flight test section:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=572

Newtoit, which version of the T-Rex do you have? Can you post a picture?

[newtoit]

Thanks for correcting me. My Shogun spins 2000 in normal, 2200 in idl2. But those are setup for 3D and more responsive than a beginner would need.

I read other reviews that indicated for the T-Rex in norm 1700-1800 is good and 2200 is for 3D setup.

Here is a good review, they cover headspeed in the flight test section:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=572

Newtoit, which version of the T-Rex do you have? Can you post a picture?

yeah, i will try. its the 450 se with as much top of the line bling as i could find for it. i was trying in the begining to make the gy611 work with this thing but you know.......

[newtoit]

That headspeed is too low for the Trex. I would get it to at least 2200 to make it stable.

you mean 2200rpm at 3/4 stick. thats where i have 5.5 pitch. correct? to hover?

[Motions]

Correct.

What ESC are you using and are you running governor mode?

[newtoit]

Correct.

What ESC are you using and are you running governor mode?

align 35a and i dont know if i am running governor mode. do i need to be?
btw, from what i can tell, the flight sims wont run on my 2004 dell dimension 3000.
i have a pci running a intel graphics extreme.
from what i understand i need ati with an excellerated 3d card of 128mb.
am i wrong? what changes could i make to get the g3 sim to work?/

[newtoit]

justin case anyone, is on pins and needles, i have not flown yet. i took a few days off from it after getting over that hump. talk to me.

[mb323]

justin case anyone, is on pins and needles, i have not flown yet. i took a few days off from it after getting over that hump. talk to me.

That's a good idea, you should learn to hover on a SIM before trying the T-Rex. Most local hobby shops will have a PC setup running G3 that you can try out.

As for your hardware, take a look at Realflight's web site for system requirements:
http://www.realflight.com/requirements/g3_system.html

From what I remember, G3 has options you can turn off to improve performance on slower machines, things like terrain detail, smoke, etc.

[newtoit]

That's a good idea, you should learn to hover on a SIM before trying the T-Rex. Most local hobby shops will have a PC setup running G3 that you can try out.

As for your hardware, take a look at Realflight's web site for system requirements:
http://www.realflight.com/requirements/g3_system.html

From what I remember, G3 has options you can turn off to improve performance on slower machines, things like terrain detail, smoke, etc.

hi ya mb,
guess what?..................................................LIFTOFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yup. cranked it up to 3/4 throttle and she jumped up like a grasshopper. of course i sat it back down quick. FINALLY!
i am now building a second t-rex as i had enough (almost) parts to do it again. i had bought extras for crashing and such.
as for g3, i dont know if it will even begin to run on my computer with only an intel extreme graphics card. i heard it was crap. i didnt really buy the new computer to play games anything like that (i could kick myself now).
my hobby stores here are nothing but hungates. they dont deal in any stuff like this.
i am going to look into some of these free downloadable ones i keep hearing about that are not too fancy but will help me on the basics.
hey , that training eggbeater came in handy cause it would have never sat back down strait without it.
take care and i appreciate you and motions (you cant learn it on a forum) help.

[mb323]

Newtoit, congratulations and good luck... remember, if it was easy, everyone would be doing it! :D

[newtoit]

Newtoit, congratulations and good luck... remember, if it was easy, everyone would be doing it! :D
that really is true. i gotta change my user name now that i am a veteran. :)
i ll get some photos of the heli and the new one i am building as soon as i can.
i got 3 different colors in the head of the new one. it looks cool. i am also interchanging colors on other parts of it and mixing up plastic stabilizers and cf. the frame will be the black cf. it will look like no one elses t-rex, thats for sure.

[Mark Jester]

I bought a Hitec Optic 6 on ebay from Tom's RC. Actually I got most of my electrics from there... Anyway, the Optic 6 from them came with a transmitter to USB cable and free FMS simulator software. My boss has the G3 software and compared my FMS to the G3.

He said that the G3 had better graphics but pretty much the FMS was the same as the G3. He could not get the G3 to work until he upgraded his video card. That cost, on top of the 189.00 was pretty high. I have a high end video card anyway but I am told the FMS does not require all that horsepower to function. And after putting together my shogun with a couple of nicer bells and whistles, buying the G3 was just not an option! I am told the G3 also drops frames from time to time. The FMS has never dropped a frame. Maybe since it does not have all the great graphics it does not need the horsepower to keep running smoothly.

I also like the fact that I have the same transmitter for both flight and sim duties. The G3 comes with its own low end transmitter. I am not sure you can even buy the G3 without their transmitter. I would just rather practice with the equipment I use. Being a peace officer, I don't go to the range and practice with a 9mm when I carry a .45 on duty. It's important to keep things constant.

And finally, the FMS is at the low end of the sim food chain. But for being free and having the capabilities of downloading a million "models" (also for free) worked best for me. G3 is on the high end of the food chain and should be. It's really nice. I would rather spend the money on parts than on a high end sim. This way, I have both a practice sim AND parts! :rolleyes: Just my two cents. Thanks for listening.

[tdswan]

The biggest problem with FMS is that the "realism" cannot even be called realism. The models have no inertia. It's OK for learning hover, but for learning any new tricks or 3D at all, the models don't react like a real one. Things like the tail kicking on a hard climbout or a transition from inverted to right-side-up. Headspeed dropping and bogging in hard meneuvers. The tail doesn't get sloppy when the headspeed drops. Things like this are hard to simulate at all, but G3 at least does well on simulating things like this. Beginners, it's fine to use FMS, but you'll find a rude awakening when you learn any 3D on it and then try it with a real bird.

Yes, G3 is expensive so I'm not saying everyone on every budget should have it. FMS will help a beginner learn orientation, nose-in, even the basic inverted flight. It's great for that and it's free, I'm just saying that somewhere along the line you will need more realism if you plan to advance past a sport flyer to some 3D.

I hope I didn't ruffle anyone's feathers, but I just picked up G3 last week and have tried reflex. Both are good. I learned without the aid of a sim because I didn't want to drop the money on it either. I did later get FMS but I found it no help for the stuff I was trying to learn. Just practicing 3D on G3 for the few hours I have already, I noticed a VAST improvement in my skills and I am now wondering why I didn't drop the money on it sooner.

Just my 0.02 worth.

[mb323]

The biggest problem with FMS is that the "realism" cannot even be called realism.

That is a great point, it's the realism, on FMS I can put a heli in a stable hover and leave it there without touching the sticks, both right side up and inverted. Litteraly I got up, answered the phone and when I got back a few minutes later the heli was still hovering in the same spot. A truly hands off stable hover is not possible on G3, Reflex or with a real heli.

FMS is probably good for learning basic stick movements but not for learning anything realistic. It may shorten your learning curve because now you know which directions to move the sticks, but you don't learn how a real heli will feel or react.

What happens on G3 and Reflex is pretty close to what happens with a real heli.

Definately cost is a factor in purchasing a sim, they are not cheap. But consider how much you spent on your heli, for a shogun it's 500+, one crash will cost you anywhere from $100-$300 depending on the amount of carnage (yes it could be less if you just tip it over or have a hard langing). So if the sim saves you from 1 crash, it's pretty much paid for itself. Which would you rather do, rebuild your heli or hit the reset button.

There is a caveat, a sim won't prepare you for everything but a good one will get you darn close.

A cheap alternative to a SIM is to find someone to buddy-box you on your heli. A more expensive alternative to those two is to try and learn it on your own, I have seen a friend total 3 heli's before he learned to hover.

One comment, both G3 and Reflex are capable of using your transmitter.

[newtoit]

nothing new to report. still not flying. pretty helicopter been sitting on the table for months.
just wanted to stay on top here in the forums. :D
oh and helihobby is still a crook of a company. avoid at all costs.

[Crazy Ant]

Try this one. it is dedicated to T-Rex, called T-Rex tunning
http://www.trextuning.com/index.php anything you could possibly want to know
best of luck :)

[SAAB-o-matic]

I know how you feel. I started three years ago woth a Nexus 30 by myself. It took a good season to get the thing running. The best book I got was by Paul Tradulus (spelling is probably wrong) a beginers guide to rc helicopters. It explains everything you need to get off the ground. Go to your hobby and see if they have it. The on line store should have it too.
I had a similar problem with the blades spinning but no lift off. The pitch was not set right. You need a pitch guage to check it out. I'm still using an old futaba skyport radio (no pitch points to adjust) and a pitch at 5-6 degrees at mid stick should get it off the ground.
I have only used one pitch guage so I can only tell you how I checked the pitch. You put a fly bar level guage (a small level that hangs off the flybar) and secure the flybar so it is level and will not move up or down. My pitch guage came with a clamp and level to use. Next you attatch the pitch meter to the main rotor blade and read the degrees on the meter. Adjust your control arms and your radio mixes to get the pitch you want.
Take it from a cheapskate...buy or get ahold of a simulator. Find a hobby shop that has one running for demo purposes and use theirs if you have too. I crashed my nexus twice (minor) and spent three hundred dollars to fix it. The simulator whould have prevented the crashs and would have saved me 100 bucks. Most have a tutorial to train you to fly. Good luck!